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Post by Sporlo on Jun 20, 2008 3:58:13 GMT
Not much of a post, but in summary, my desktop computer froze before it even finished starting up. A few days ago, it started getting REALLY slow. HORRIBLY slow. To a point that you could not use it productively. (bleh, I'm getting a strong whiff of cat piss, fake log ashes, bleach, and bathroom cleaner. From the fireplace. I think you can guess from that what happened...) So I unplugged the computer for 2 days for the heck of it, and unplugged the internet. I plugged it back in tonight, not internet though, and it started pretty fast, but then it just froze when the time didn't come up. Any comments, advice, random ideas? It kinda sucks having only one computer now cuz I don't get to use it as often
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Post by IsraeliRD on Jun 20, 2008 4:57:18 GMT
harddrive problems? computer about to die? backup fast before it might be too late (and its recommended to have backups every 6 months or so).
I also need to back-up.. will do it over my holidays.
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Post by phil on Jun 20, 2008 5:09:47 GMT
Got Leopard? Use Time Machine.
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Post by technostick on Jun 20, 2008 6:27:39 GMT
Shake it about... that worked for my old iMac G4 desktop, which had almost the same problem.
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Post by Pablo on Jun 20, 2008 13:11:31 GMT
If it's an option, I would recommend getting a PC. ( )
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Post by Lonestar on Jun 20, 2008 15:22:26 GMT
Pablo, if wants the problem fixed, not a computer that will do it again. It's possible your logic board is burning out, it seems to be a defect to specific Apple computers. It also seems to have symptoms of the hard drive failure that happens across MacBooks and MacBook Pros, but if that were the case the computer would fail all together. I had a similar problem after failing the tri-boot thing and restoring to Leopard only, which confused me. If I wanted a computer that slow, I would have gotten a PC (Pablo. ). I found that if you reset RAM (PRAM and NVRAM) slots you might be able to fix the problem, if they fill and don't dump for some reason the computer can run slowly. Hold Command, Option, P, and R while booting (press the combination before the grey screen appears and hold), and keep holding until you hear the startup noise a second time. Your clock might be reset, but if the speed isn't back to normal after that I would have an Apple Store diagnose a problem, it sounds like the Logic Board could be causing the issue. I should work for Apple.... pay better then Fareway.
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Post by MarbleDuck on Jun 20, 2008 21:17:38 GMT
If it's an option, I would recommend getting a PC. ( ) grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr Oh. Did you do a clean install of your operating system, if it's new?
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Post by Sporlo on Jun 20, 2008 21:31:42 GMT
it's way old. over 2 years. or more. Well thanks for the input. lol Lonestar how do you know all that
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Post by Lonestar on Jun 21, 2008 0:03:43 GMT
I am a wealth of useful information.
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Post by trace on Jun 21, 2008 0:17:28 GMT
PC DO NOT BREAK DOWN! MACS BREAK DOWN! YOU BREAK DOWN! THE WORLD BREAKS DOWN! PCS FTW!
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Post by Sporlo on Jun 21, 2008 1:28:11 GMT
my old desktop computer when it was healthy ran faster than my friend's brand new PC with XP. And that was even after Leopard made it slower. As long as it doesn't die, I'm assuming Snow Leopard will speed it up a bit.
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Post by Andrew on Jun 21, 2008 1:34:26 GMT
Objection! If you haven't read the top five entries in Matan's blog, read them. It clearly talks about how his PC died, and the hassle he went through to get it fixed. So you are WRONG Trace! PCS CAN BREAK DOWN!
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Post by IsraeliRD on Jun 21, 2008 1:56:31 GMT
Lets break this down:
1) Trace, shut it. 5% Warning we don't need any wars here. Pablo, same for you. 2) Marbleduck, I saw your post at my topic and same goes to you. 3) Andrew, it was the power supply, ends up I was given NOT ENOUGH (500Watts) so they put it to the correct specification (620Watts). The PC itself was completely fine and in fact never broke down. Don't say stuff that's not true aka don't lie and create wars. Consider yourself also warned like the three people above.
If this PC/MAC war continues, warnings and suspensions will be given.
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Post by Lonestar on Jun 21, 2008 4:07:50 GMT
Computers are computers, they each use similar parts and operate in similar ways. If a computer breaks down completely, it's due to a hardware failure. The hardware of a computer has almost nothing to do with the operating system, you can run Windows on Macs and hack OS X to run on PCs. Running Windows on a Mac won't make the Mac any more likely to break down, and the same would go for running OS X on a PC. A hardware failure can be universal to all computers, Macs, PCs, and even those sucky old IBM ones that existed in the days of 2 bit processing. You can't say a PC will break down before a Mac will, it all depends on the quality of the computer. Our Gateway lived for 14 years without a single problem, and our iMac and my MacBook have the same safety record. Anything can fail at any time, but the majority of the time it won't. Problems happen, and when they do it's far more helpful to give advice and post constructively then to argue over why the other brand of computer sucks so bad. On to something halfway relevant, did Sprolo's problem ever get fixed?
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Post by Sporlo on Jun 21, 2008 15:48:56 GMT
k, I'm tying that RAM reset right now. WHOA! For the first time, I noticed there's Dock burn-in on the screen! That's so weird. Anyway's it's slowly starting up... .... ..... .......... .................. nothing to the right of the menu bar except Spotlight mouse input is fine (as it always has been). I'm afraid to draw a selection box OMG THE TIME CAME UP!!! Time didn't reset, but unfortunately I'm pretty sure it's still slow. Yep, took about 1+ seconds to respond to click and drag on the screen. GREAAT. Clock has frozen and mouse input is WAY laggy. CRAP totally dead. I think it might've been because I accidentally put the mouse in the bottom left corner, which is a "hot corner" (whatever their called) for the screen saver Dang it this sucks. But I guess as you said in the PM the RAM reset probably wouldn't work. Apparently it didn't.
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Post by Lonestar on Jun 21, 2008 16:53:59 GMT
Aww... if it failed like that, it's a hardware failure. Take it to an Apple store, see what they have to say. I would guess the Logic Board is dying, but it could be a number of things... I can't fix any of them from here though. Sorry. :\
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Post by Sporlo on Jun 21, 2008 19:09:28 GMT
Well, after a lot of searching I've found TONS of random forum sites where people have posted problems very similar to mine. There's even a program from Apple to repair certain models free of charge with certain video/power problems. Unfortunately that's not quite what's wrong with mine, and the serial # doesn't match (only the first 3 characters match ). So I'm pretty sure you're right Lonestar, the logic board. I've seen mixed prices, but I think a lot were around $1000-. I think one person said they got their logic board replaced by Apple with like some sort of letter from them, but I don't know if that was program related or not. Then, I saw someone said they told a store about some Customer Rights thing and they were like "we take that very seriously, NOW we'll help you" and the person got his problems solved. It's weird how almost all our electronics problems end up being very widespread, which I guess is good, because it means we didn't just have an unlucky product, but at the same time it's like unlucky that we happened to buy that certain defective product. How unfortunate that it just so happens that our model of computer is one to have so many reported problems. Another annoying thing about the internet is that it's so plagued with problems that it's impossible to find SOLUTIONS. So I guess now all we can really do is bring it into the Apple Store near us. My dad doesn't like the people there too much. He doesn't like all the specific rules and conditions that come with large companies. We had some sort of issue with getting a teacher discount one time. www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/technology_news/1707941.htmlRead reader comment 53. He's the one with the consumer rights thing. There's lots of replies on that topic. Like I said half of it is simply people reporting problems and getting no answers.
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Post by eguee on Jun 22, 2008 0:11:51 GMT
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Post by Sporlo on Jun 26, 2008 1:26:07 GMT
Well, we'll probably end up buying a new desktop. However, as our hard drive is still fine and nothing's wrong with it, we now need a way to recover some stuff (if we can't it actually isn't that big a deal, most of it is already on the laptop). Does anyone know the best way (or a good way at least) to recover stuffs from our hard drive? I know like companies can do that stuff but I don't really know how or whatever. I very very highly doubt it, but I was thinking it would be nice if you could plug in our old hard drive into a new desktop and then get stuff to the laptop, then replug the new hard drive that came with the computer back in. It'd only work if everything is all the same still after all those generation updates from Apple, and that I doubt. Not to mention the new one would be Intel and my old one is PPC. But I also know nothing about these things, so I couldn't possibly know what would happen.
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Post by eguee on Jun 26, 2008 10:33:51 GMT
Try googling "hard drive file recovery"
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Post by IsraeliRD on Jun 26, 2008 14:01:24 GMT
recuva.com ... wait, thats not for MACs
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Post by marblefire on Jun 26, 2008 15:49:12 GMT
You should get a backup drive in the future, and continually backup onto there. However, I have used a software called Data Rescue X or something like that, and it works well for file recoveries, although the process will take a few hours.
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Post by Sporlo on Jun 26, 2008 17:27:40 GMT
Yeah, we might get an external drive, but really we don't need one that bad, as like I said before, most of our stuff was on the laptop already. And also, remember, I have no computer to use with the hard drive. The computer is DEAD. So in order to get the files, I'd need to either fix the computer (in which case I need to do nothing else) or get some hardware that can read it or something. Software right now is useless as there's no computer to put the software on.
Would it be possible to get an adapter and connect the hard drive to the laptop via USB?
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Post by Lonestar on Jun 26, 2008 21:39:11 GMT
Probably not USB, you'd have to physically remove the hard drive and then physically switch it with the laptop's hard drive, boot the computer, back up to somewhere else, and then put the hard drives back. I don't know exactly what connection the hard drive has with the computer internally, but it would certainly not be something like USB, and I doubt there would be an adapter for it. You might be able to have the people at the Apple store salvage it for you if it's necessary, we had our people at iTech do it once when our first G5 was defective. If you have everything you need backed up to the laptop I don't know if it'd be worth the effort, but I don't know exactly what you lost so I wouldn't be able to help much there. There are ways to save the harddrive, but you'd have to go to a specialty shop/Apple store and probably pay something, and it's up to you whether that's worth it or not.
EDIT: Actually, disregard the part about switching hard drives with the laptop. You've said the G5 was PPC and the laptop is Intel, PPC OS X wouldn't run on an intel processor and the computer wouldn't be able to boot. So your only other option would be a specialty shop/Apple store, sorry.
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Post by Sporlo on Jul 7, 2008 2:16:19 GMT
Even more interesting computer news! Will it ever stop? ... So, out of utter boredness, I decided to test our iMac ONE MORE TIME... heh... Looking a bit better this time. Takes basically just as long to start up, but at least it doesn't die as soon as you click the mouse. I didn't really have any plans, just wanted to see what would happen. I literally had no expectations. Surprisingly, (after I had plugged in the LAN cable) and suddenly, THE MICROSOFT AUTOUPDATE APPLICATION TRIES TO START UP! How ironic. The LAST thing you need for a slow computer is for a random application try to open itself on its own Even more amazingly, the computer didn't freeze! I canceled the update, when what do you know! The Software Update app opens up as well! Purely for the heck of it, I decided to install version 10.5.4. Take a guess. Yes, yet again I was surprised that it actually finished installing the software. And... when I was THAT close to actually doing something productive with a dead computer (quite a feat imo )... it stalled out while trying to restart. The Apple logo sat there doing nothing with a bluish background and a MOVING progress circle for about... 2 hours? I gave up and force turned it off. Good news though: in the midst of all the above, I successfully transfered a small file from the iMac to the MacBook. So at least I have the option to TRY to transfer a few more files if needed.
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Post by Lonestar on Jul 8, 2008 4:52:52 GMT
If it's the logic board, you'd think it would just be fried... new theory! This one will require some ingenuity on your part. Sometimes hard drives get the diskhead stuck on the face of the drive, causing failure. If you remove the hard drive and put it in the freezer overnight, the metal parts shrink and the diskhead will come off the surface of the drive, and the hard drive will function for a short while. That's been documented to really work with computers, and it works long enough to back up data usually. So if you're willing to take the computer apart, put the hard drive in the freezer overnight and then put it back in the next day and boot up really fast. See if that does anything if you're willing to just try something, it doesn't look like you're getting far with what you have so it might be worth a shot...
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Post by Sporlo on Jul 9, 2008 2:30:19 GMT
Hmmm... Yeah I almost just opened the computer just for the heck of it, not really to do anything Sounds like it works, I saw some other random sites with people confirming it, so I'll at least see if my dad approves.
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Post by Sporlo on Jul 10, 2008 4:16:21 GMT
This is CRAZY. Very cool. So, my dad was like, "Sure, why not?" to freezing our hard drive. So I did. Here's a few pictures: Open computer w/fan cover on the right Closer up Cool logic board. (no visible burn marks ) In the freezer! Next to all the meats and a naked burger patty that I hope no one eats. Closer up Back cover of computer (EDIT: interesting, I just noticed ImageShack uses the pictures' metadata (I think that's what it's called, I saw the word on Wikipedia) to tell what camera was used) So I sealed up the hard drive, stuck it in the freezer for roughly 1 hour. I was afraid the condensation might be a problem. It was perfectly dry when I took it out of the freezer, but as soon as I took it out of the bag, it slowly collected a thin layer of moisture. Luckily it caused no problems. I got it back into the computer fine, but it was SOOO cold! My fingers hurt for a couple seconds . And later it was odd having one quarter of the computer cool, while the rest was warm. When I started up the computer, I was slightly disappointed to find that it was no faster than before. The slowness lasted for about 15 minutes, when suddenly... IT GOT BACK TO NORMAL SPEED AGAIN!! I was seriously like "OMG, THIS IS AMAZING!" I was shocked. So I tested it out and started up Safari, one of the more demanding apps (compared to other ones I was testing like Preview), and the internet was totally normal! The app functioned PERFECTLY with great network speed as well. ONE time I noticed that spinning rainbow appeared for a half second, so the WHOLE time I was expecting everything to come crashing down die like before. Amazingly it never did and it stayed fast. I almost tried to open iPhoto (the computer's most demanding app, and the version is about 2 years behind, so it's very slow in itself), but my dad just said shut it down, leave it alone for the night, and I can try it tomorrow to see if the warmed up hard drive gets slow again or for some strange reason stays fast. I'm assuming it'll get slow again, in which case I'll freeze the hard drive for 24 hours instead of 1 to see if I get the same results, and then I'll also test lots more apps and test its speed. I honestly have no idea what will happen tomorrow. What amazes me though is the fact that it got faster AFTER some time. The whole concept of the freezing would suggest its performance would deteriorate over time, yet it got better over time, so I'm stumped. My computer is really strange.
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Post by Lonestar on Jul 10, 2008 4:27:39 GMT
It could be possible the computer just had a bad connection, and by taking it out and putting it back in your fixed it? Really, putting the HD in the freezer for only an hour wouldn't have done much, a HD with the problems that requires freezing would be in overnight and then work for about 45 minutes to a few hours, depending on the damage. I suppose only time will tell if somethings wrong or if it's fixed. (One hour probably wouldn't freeze the internal components, only freeze the skin and cool the inside, but I could be wrong on that. Hey, it worked right? ) About condensation, I've heard some people talk about worrying for it and I never saw it being a problem. I saw one guy who put his entire iBook in the freezer overnight and the condensation when he took it out didn't break it (then again iBooks are freaking tough ), but you shouldn't worry much about condensation as long as you sealed it well. btw — that picture of your hard drive in the freezer = priceless
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Post by Sporlo on Jul 10, 2008 15:43:07 GMT
GAH, this is killing me! It's like totally random now! It started up remarkably fast this morning, yet it's still really slow! Weird again, the speed is in between last night's speed and the speed of days ago. I'm happy to announce however that I'm posting this from the desktop (so it better not freeze now!). When I clicked on Safari, the entire screen turned off. Just went blank. 10 more seconds, it came back on, and it opened in another 5ish. No more fast internet x( and there's lots of lag when typing. Though now I've noticed it's kinda warmed up, and now there's almost no typing lag. Which also makes me wonder maybe the computer just needs TIME to get warmed up and get up to speed, as I guess it kinda did last night. Still, it's just too weird. Before, it would stay slow forEVER and would end up crashing to death. Now, I can at least shut it down properly. Also, if it simply was a connection problem, why does it need to "warm up" for a few minutes before becoming fast?
bleh. Simply for the heck of it I think I'll just throw it in the freezer for 24 hours like I said I would. Now this is no longer a problem but really a nuisance. I think I have an undead computer.
EDIT: !@#@$%!%$#^%&@#$&^!#%^&@#%!& Same results as last night: very near 100% performance. *dies* (no, not the computer...)
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